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tv   Charlie Rose  PBS  April 15, 2014 12:00pm-1:01pm PDT

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>> charlie: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with rafael correa, the president of ecuador. >> we have different values. that doesn't mean that here in the united states you are not respecting human rights and that doesn't bethat in our country we are not respecting human rights. what about free markets? we believe in society's markets but not societies overruled by markets. i think that's one of the most important problems in the present time is that markets are controlling everything. we believe in societies with markets, but society must govern the market. >> charlie: also this evening, arianna huffington, her new book is called "thrive." >> if we define ourselves in
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terms of our jobs, however magnificent, in terms of our success, however great, with eare shrinking down to something that's not going to be as much fulfilling. >> charlie: rafael correa, arianna huffington, when we continue. >> there's a saying around here: you stand behind what you say. around here, we don't make excuses, we make commitments. and when you can't live up to them, you own up and make it right. some people think the kind of accountability that thrives on so many streets in this country has gone missing in the places where it's needed most. but i know you'll still find it, when you know where to look.
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captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> charlie: rafael correa is here, the president of ecuador. i'm pleased to have him here to talk about his country, his sense of where latin america may be going and what he believes is the best way to do more things for the people of ecuador. welcome. >> thank you very much for inviting me, charlie. it's an honor to be here and to meet you. >> charlie: when you look at your goals for ecuador, what are they? >> well, the model for our government and for the entire
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world, to eliminate poverty. to have a country with justice, dignity, prosperity. >> charlie: and what do you have to do to achieve that? >> this is a very good question. thank you very much. i have studied all my life. before becoming president, i was a professor. i studied economics here in the states. i can tell you that development is basically a political process, especially i in latin america. you have to change our relationship, why we are underdeveloped, because we have historically been controlled by elite, powerful groups. our elite. so you have to change these power relationships, and we are doing exactly that through very
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democratic processes. but lately, it's not just a political process, it's also a technical process. after changing power, you have to be very technical to improve your people's standard of living. >> charlie: if there was too much power in the elite, how will you eliminate that power and give more power to the people? >> changing institutions, changing policies, changing products. for instance, we had a new constitution. the former constitution gave advantages to some groups. our new constitution prohibits to have a bank. that was a very important source -- >> charlie: legitimate? -- legitimate power for some groups. so in ecuador, if you're a banker, you must be a banker. if you want to have media, you
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just have have a media. but you cannot have both of them. you have good thing to start having public media controlled not by the government. >> charlie: that's my point. by the society. >> charlie: the media in ecuador, could it criticize the president? >> of course. mostly, they are owned by the elite. we are -- i don't know the right word -- fighting, too. anyway, but the public media, also they have independence and they can criticize the government. >> charlie: let me talk about how you see the role of government, and you're obviously a socialist. >> yes. >> charlie: what does that mean to you? >> a socialist, to look for social justice. >> charlie: and who have been
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the academics as well as the political figures who have influenced the way you see government? >> well, my political thinking has been influenced by the catholic church and the liberation theology, because i was in that in my youth. also loua and bercill. >> charlie: and i chavez in venezuela and you admire both loula and chavez because of what they did in changing their country?
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>> yes. you should remember what venezuela was before chavez. venezuela were the most important oil producers in the world, and where all this money went outside of the country. so now venezuela is strongly reducing poverty. it's one of the most equal countries in latin america. before, it was one of the more unequal countries. so chavez caused positive changes. >> charlie: in addition to reducing poverty, there's a question of medical care, of education. >> yes, of course. >> charlie: of jobs. how will you meet those challenges? >> well, we have been very successful in these policies, in these sectors. we are doing a lot of reforms and improving very fast our
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education system and also our health system. our economic performance is one of the best in the region. for instance, our unemployment rate is around 4%. >> charlie: better than the united states? >> i didn't want to say that. but you said it. >> charlie: define the relationship with the united states today. >> well, we would like to improve the relation. i think we have good relations but i think it could be better. >> charlie: how would it be better? >> to know each other in a better way, to understand what is going on in ecuador, to know a little more. not just ecuador, the whole latin america. >> charlie: do you have a sense that the united states listens to you, that the united states cares about what you say, that the united states cares about the future of ecuador? >> define what is the united states. the people, academia? >> charlie: my reference was
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governance of obama. >> i don't think so. >> charlie: why do you believe that? >> well, initially, the policy of the united states hasn't taken into account america. they have mexico, they have brazil, they have argentina. the biggest countries and economies, colombia, too. but they are not too much taking into account ecuador, and that is a situation that must change. >> charlie: and what are you prepared to do to see it change? >> well, you know, this is not a priority for us because we are an independent country. at least to let us continue to do what we think is the better thing for our people. >> charlie: but here's the interesting question. you look at mexico and other places -- do you believe that the private sector can play a role in the economy of a
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country, number one and, number two, play a role in the economy and contribute to the growth of ecuador? >> but of course. >> charlie: so that it can do more for its people? >> but, of course. for the betterment of the economy and society. we are modern socialists, you know. we don't deny the market, but we have the society must govern the market. >> charlie: govern the market, yes. >> every national private investment or foreign investment is welcome, but as long as they respect our country, our institutions, our laws. >> charlie: and those private companies, obviously, would ask the question, does the government of ecuador respect the rule of law. >> of course. >> charlie: does it respect individual rights? >> usually the international
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didn't respect our country. but, any, we are receiving a lot of international investment right now. >> charlie: do you believe the united states government is in any way trying to be in opposition to you? >> well, i don't think so. i think what makes a very good person -- -- it is clear that certain groups inside the government, inside the congress, this and that, senate, in society, extreme right-wing groups are against ecuador, and they are manipulating information. they are telling things that are not true, et cetera. >> charlie: one of the questions always comes up with respect to you is what's happening at your embassy with the head of wikileaks, the offering of asylum to edward
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snowden. help us understand that. what is your attitude about that and what did the government of ecuador do and how do you see it? >> we didn't offer asylum to edward snowden. he requested it. >> charlie: i know he did. i realize i misspoke. >> he has a right, human rights. >> charlie: would you have granted him asylum. >> to snowden? >> charlie: yes. we would have to think about that. >> charlie: was there pressure on the part of the united states to urge you not to do it, not to give him a place to go when he was in moscow? >> well, vice president biden called me and we had a very friendly conversation. >> charlie: what was your conversation like? >> very nice. >> charlie: he said? he said he'ser are important to put snowden to face the american justice, et cetera. we understand all that, but they should understand, too, that we
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are a sovereign country and we make our own decisions. we should be clear. perhaps i don't agree. but the problem is not politics, the problem is justice. we examined during two months the request of asylum and we conclude that, yes, he was right. related to what? that there was no guarantee of due process. for this reason, we grant asylum. >> charlie: because you thought they were trying to extradite him to a system that was not due process? >> yes. remember some people from the united states were asking to penalize him according to laws that included the penalty. do you remember that? >> charlie: yes, of course, i do. >> we don't have the penalty in our country and according to
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american convention of human rights, ther the penalty is agat human right. >> charlie: you thought due process was not there and granted him asylum. >> yes. >> charlie: what happens if rewanthewants to come to ecuado? >> he will be welcome. >> charlie: why doesn't he come? >> well, he can stay as long as necessary -- >> charlie: in the embassy. yes. >> charlie: and edward snowden, if he requested asylum would be able to come to ecuador? >> the request. >> charlie: what is your opinion of american foreign policy? >> i don't like to comment about policies of foreign countries, but, in this case, foreign policies involves us, so i can tell you, usually, american
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foreign policy has been wrong. i think you need to know us more closely in a better way. >> charlie: that seems easy to accomplish. >> yes, but it is necessary. >> charlie: the united states has good relations with brazil, with -- >> yes, with some governments, sometimes very questionable governments, they are considered with the united states everything is fine. with other governments, if they consider that these governments are not realized by the united states, everything is wrong. that must be improved. >> charlie: so the united states government and state department says, we appreciate the people of ecuador's right to elect the political leadership
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they want, we appreciate an effort, regardless of political philosophy, to eradicate poverty, to provide broader education, to raise the level of healthcare and to be a good neighbor, and we realize, the united states might say, that the relationship between the united states and latin america has had significant reasons for the people to question the united states' interest in latin america. was it simply for their own gain? lots of americans have made the argument that our relationship with latin america has a number -- in several instances, involved too much effort to change governments. i know, but stay with me. >> the record is -- >> charlie: i understand, but that has not been true about the
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obama administration. at the same time, they might say to you, what are we to think? because the people you're the closest to -- chavez, cuba -- are people that have made it part of their philosophy to consistently attack the united states and, in cases, to deny the human rights of some of their own people. >> i tell you two things. first -- >> charlie: no disrespect. no, no. your question, this situation, why? sorry i expressed myself in the wrong way. i really want to say that. i meant the situation. because why? for insubstance, the standard of the government, the politician,
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sometimes, the states, for instance, venezuela is very good friends of those without democracy. so at least here we have standards. >> charlie: the point is taken. we have good relationships with countries who do not necessarily believe in democracy as we perceive it. you do believe in democracy as we perceive it, right? >> yes. >> charlie: clearly we have relationships with governments -- >> you have tons of relationships. but the venezuelan elite is not happy with this, so the government -- this is very
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difficult and questionable. secondly, charlie. the united states, without any doubt, is the most powerful country in the human history and one of the most successful in the human history. but i think there is a little problem. you have very important values. i think your values must be -- you think your values must be universal values, and that is aa mistake. we can have different philosophies. >> charlie: the values we most seem to believe in are values hat the world believes in having to do with democracy. it's not our definition of democracy. >> who's the world? the united states? >> charlie: but if you look at the governments who have been more successful, they have had those values at the core -- the freedom of expression, the freedom of expression of the individuals, the freedom of expression of human rights -- or they've made a strong effort to go, and this president will be
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the first to tell you. and they also believe in free markets. we have friends who don't necessarily believe in free markets. you subsidize your free markets. >> charlie: yes, we do. but tell me how you believe about free markets? >> let me comment about something. everybody agrees with these kind of values. but remember, for instance, during french revolution, in the name of liberty, heads were cut. because everybody talks about free speech, free press, liberty, so we have different institutions according to different principles, different values. that doesn't mean that here in the united states you you are
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not respecting human rights or in our country we are not respecting human rights. markets, we believe in societies with markets but not societies ruled by markets and i think that's one of the most important problems in the present time is markets are controlling everything. we believe in society with a free market but the society must govern the market. >> charlie: when you look at the chinese experiment of development, what do you think? are you admiring of it and how they've changed china? >> i think every country must look for the best solution for their problems, and china had huge problems. you can remember the hungry people in china. >> charliechina.
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that market is a very good servant but a terrible master so society must control these markets. >> charlie: do you think in the united states that the market is the master? >> yes. >> charlie: you do? this is the problem. that is the problem. the market is controlling society. capital controlling human beings. and why the united states has been so successful, because the system allowed, in order to generate technological and scientific advances, and that improved the life of everybody. but you have a problem of who has the control of the society, who has the power, who is in charge. with all due respect. >> charlie: well, with all due respect, i differ on that. and why do you think -- and this is a conversation to understand you -- >> you know that 1% of american people controls more than one-third of the national
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wealth? >> charlie: yes, i understand that -- >> and 10% of the wealthiest people controls 75% of the national wealth? >> charlie: i do understand that. but let me just ask this -- why do so many people want to come to the united states? what is it about american values and the american experience that you so disagree with, but they want to come here, to work, to do the kinds of things they want, to get an education they want. there's a reason for that, and you seem to be saying that this is a bad society because the market controls everything and capitalism is bad, yet people around the world want to come here. >> sort of because -- >> charlie: and they don't look at this country as a bad place. >> i gave you a wrong impression. i didn't make myself clear.
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i love the united states. it's a very wonderful country, but you have a problem, okay? >> charlie: and the problem we have? >> that everything is a function of the capital, a function of the market. you didn't feel this problem before because of the technological advances. in the crisis, when you have the resources, you start to see the problem. the middle class families haven't recovered the level of income before the crisis. but bankers, et cetera, are having records profit. that's a problem. >> charlie: clearly that's a fact. clearly the financial sector has regained after being in a vair bad place in 2008, has regained its profitability. >> and it's worth a lot. and i love the united states. i criticize the foreign policy and the double standards sometimes in foreign relations.
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>> charlie: environmental issues. there was a group in ecuador called pacacama (phonetic). what was your problem with them? >> my personal problem -- nothing. but they broke the law. you know, they called to common administration in order to explore the south part of our country, to explore for oil. well, they have all the right to do the demonstration, et cetera, but they are our people and they have to be responsible for these attacks. >> charlie: generally, i like people like me. i assume you feel the same way. but i hear about an ecuador
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where, with respect, if you don't like something or if they oppose you, you will shut it down and declare it illegal. >> that is not true, with all due respect, charlie. i am used to different criteria, different argument, et cetera, but we condemn violence and, during these demonstrations, there was violence. >> charlie: and you expelled the u.s. a ambassador. >> well, come on. come on. did you read the weeklies that this lady sent to the american government? and when we asked her to explain why she sent this untrue information, she answered, well, i don't care, i don't have to give you information. for this reason, we had to expel her. it's important.
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we don't want to do things like that. but we will make to respect our country. >> charlie: how is your political party doing? >> about what? >> charlie: in the most recent elections. >> oh, well, yes, we won the last election. we obtain the majority of the votes. we won the municipalities -- like here, the governors, et cetera. but we are used to 5 against 0. this time 3 and 2. >> so there were h people who won in certain cities that oppose you and your party? >> no. these are not ideological
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elections. people vote for the person. >> charlie: do you want to see ecuador take on a larger regional role in latin america? chavez is gone, fidel is old and some say sick. raul is talking about changing cuba, transitioning cuba to more of a market economy. >> of course. and with the embargo -- without the embargo, would be even faster. >> charlie: well, indeed. in any case, we are not interested in being -- to have leadership. we have enough work inside our country trying to improve the standard of living of our people. but we will reap where it counts
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and where people have need of us, we can serve. >> charlie: are you optimistic about the relationship with the united states? or don't care? >> no, i'm not really optimistic. i would like to improve the relationship with any country in the world, especially with the united states, it has been a very close country to ecuador, so it would be great if we can improve our relations. >> charlie: how long will you be president? >> till 2017. >> charlie: the new constitution was better than the old constitution because it accomplished what? >> a lot of things. the former constitution was a liberal constitution. even to the power groups, economic groups, financial groups, a lot of advantages.
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so when your constitution guarantees a -- so the new constitution guarantees a lot of rights for our people. >> charlie: there are many people today who argue that canada, the united states and latin america ought to have, you know, better trade, better economic relationships, new development, that that could make this a remarkably productive time for everything in this hemisphere. do you disagree with that? >> yes, because -- i know -- >> charlie: you disagree with that because of what? >> alexander hamilton in the states, all the united states traditionally opposed free market because he didn't have enough technological products,
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et cetera. once he got all this and it is the most efficient economy in the world, well, now, it preach as free market. but if that were true, well, now mexico would be a developed country. almost 20 years of market with the united states, and that is not true at all. >> charlie: why do most people look at mexico and think it now has the best and most effective economy in all of latin america? >> mexico? >> charlie: mexico. who has a better economy than mexico in latin america? >> ecuador. >> charlie: really? according to the economic commission for latin america in the united nations, ecuador is reducing equality in the region, one of three countries reducing
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poverty. >> charlie: if you want to see the future of what the government can do, come to ecuador? >> well, no, we've done a lot of mistakes, but at least our people know very well that they have the power, that we are acting in order to serve then, that now ecuador is a sovereign country and, while our state is a popular state, in order to serve, i insist a majority of people. >> charlie: is there part of you that wants to say now that you came from academia and were foreign minister and wanted to change the constitution, is part of what correa wants to say is we will create a model in terms of what a government can do?
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>> the world order is not just unjust, unfair, it's immoral. the standards everywhere, everything is always about who's stronger, not about justice. so it would be wonderful if we could do that in a country like ecuador. >> charlie: thank you for coming. >> thank you. it's a pleasure to know you. >> charlie: arianna huffington is here, co-founder, president and editor in chief of the "huffington post." her new book is called "thrive: the third metric to redefining success and creating a life of well-being, wisdom, and wonder." she forgot to talk to the person who said a lot title would do fine. i am pleased to have arianna huffington back at this table. welcome. >> thank you, charlie. >> charlie: why do we need the subtitle. why couldn't we just say
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"thrive"? "thrive: the third metric to redefining success and creating a life of well-being, wisdom, and wonder." >> because the key of the book is redefining success. what is the entry point for thriving? >> charlie: yes. for me, after my wakeup call when i collapsed -- >> charlie: hit your head on the way down. >> broke my cheek bone, got four stitches in my right eye, and as i was lying in a pool of blood and going from waiting room to ecocardiogram to mri, i asked my questions, what about success? so money and power, i was successful by any sane definition of success, i was not. >> charlie: i thought you wrote it for me and you wrote it for yourself. >> i wrote it for you, too. >> charlie: it's not so much defining success for me as it is, in a serntion how do you make sure that you are taking care of yourself is not defining success. >> right. >> charlie: success comes in many forms for people. it has to do with their own appetite and what it is that
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satisfies them. i mean, it can be art, money, athletics, women, whatever, but it is how you find, as you say, a life of well being and wisdom and wonder. >> and, you know, angella was on your show and i watch your show when i'm on my treadmill and it was january 28th, just when i handed over my manuscript, and he said he has the same concern about himself as leah and that is people existing for their metaphorical crown -- whether your job, your fortune, your sex appeal, whatever it is. and that's what i'm really saying, if we define ourselves in terms of our jobs, however magnificent, in terms of our
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success, however great, we are h shrinking down to something that's not going to be as fulfilling. >> charlie: you have to define success in what way? >> as beyond these two metrics to include, first of all, taking care of ourselves. >> charlie: a conversation you and i have been having for a while. >> yes. >> charlie: why how do you take care of yourself so you don't collapse, so that you have energy, so that you're fully experiencing all the wonder of life? >> exactly. and you don't like going through life being tired. >> charlie: exactly. as i'm going through this book, i can't tell you how many people come up to me and say i don't remember the last time i wasn't tired. and i feel so sorry, because it doesn't have to be this way. but unfortunately we're living under collective delusion that it has to be this way. we constantly admire people who are working 24-7.
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working 24-7 is a problem. >> charlie: right. it's not something to congratulate people for. and they pay a heavy price. and the price we're paying is yet higher and higher, especially for women, because we internalize stress differently and, so, women in stressful jobs have a 40% greater chance of heart disease and 60% greater chance of diabetes. >> charlie: so women are different than men in terms of the way stress affects them? >> yes, stress is internalize bid women with. you've done so many great shows on the science of the brain. >> charlie: right. now we have, i quote richard davidson from the university of wisconsin, a neuroscientists who worked with tibetan monks to look at the elasticity of the brain and how meditation slows
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down the aging of the pre-frontal cortex which is linked to aging, et cetera. it's not just mimi personal journey, it's about for the first time we have the science to validate what ancient wisdom has been telling us, which is that life is shaped from the inside out. >> charlie: but you have always been in search of a range of things. i mean, you know, you have had this curiosity, apart from the drive that you have -- or maybe it's connected to it -- a curiosity for people, for being allowed -- allowing yourself to go out and experiment and to feel and to see if this is something that has all that it's said to have. >> right. >> charlie: all kinds of philosophies. >> absolutely. i've always said that and been very interested in spiritual aspects of life. the difference is -- and moving
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from appreciating this conversation, exploring it, to actually making changes in one's life. but changing habits are hard. >> charlie: it really is hard. so how does this book tell us how to change habits? >> well, that's why, at the end of each section, and the well being section has three little steps that we can take. the wisdom section, three little steps. the same for wonder and giving, because i really believe that just miking microscopic little changes in our lives, will bring such enormous rewards that we can then magnify the changes. let me just give you an example from the giving section. from the university of your home state, north carolina -- >> charlie: right. -- they found amazing research that's been done around the fact that our genes wire us towards giving so that when we're actually giving, when our happiness comes from giving as
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opposed to other per suits -- of course, life is a mixture of both -- but when it's happiness through giving, the markers in our bodies that predesupposes us to disease go down. all the inflammation markers, et cetera. when our pleasure is based more on self gratification, they go up. >> charlie: and most people know sugar is bad for you, that obesity is bad for you, that not getting enough sleep is bad for you, but don't do anything about it. >> we now know it more than ever. >> charlie: but men especially have seen where sleep deprivation -- men still brag about how much sleep they need. >> charlie: i've never done that. >> i know. but a lot of men, you hear it again and again. >> charlie: margaret thatcher used to say, i only sleep five
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hours a night. whereas churchill took pleasure at the naps he took and how he got up at 11:00 in the morning. >> equote him in the book, he says the biggest mistakes i made when i was tired. he did not specify which mistakes. but, you know, you look around and you see so many leaders in politics, in media, in business, who are making terrible mistakes. it's not that they're not smart, but they're not wise. and here, charlie, i know that you and i both are fascinated by modern technologies and what the tech world is doing, but we need to reevaluate our relationships with our device. >> charlie: i agree. because we're becoming their slaves. here's what is so interesting -- look at the attention we pay to making sure the devices are fully charged. we have little recharging shrine's everywhere in the
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offices and homes. we get the alert, 20% battery remaining -- we don't do anything like that with ourselves. we have to wait till we collapse in some form or another before we actually take steps. i want to stop these wakeup calls. i want people to make the changes before the wakeup calls. >> charlie: from mother ellie, what did she mean to you and what do you say about her in terms of how she added to her life and she was a model who inspired you to believe you could do anything you wan wante? >> she was the foundation of my life. we grew up in an apartment, no money, my father and she separated. she had an incredible sense of values. she really didn't care about
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anything material, she cared about our education. she borrowed, she was a housekeeper, to allow my sister and me to go to college. i had a picture of cambridge in the magazine, i wanted to go there. everyone said don't be ridiculous, you don't even speak english. my mother said, let's see how to get you there. she never had a degree. >> charlie: your mother was part of the reason you got to cambridge. >> yes. >> charlie: my thought was you had this indom national will and whatever you wanted, whatever energy and intelligence that was necessary to get it, you would leave no stone unturned, you would know everybody, and you would find an avenue to get to cambridge, to be head of the cambridge debating union, all of that, you would have the will to come to new york and plant your flag in new york city because
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you wished that and that all the prominent people in new york who were of accomplishment and achievement, and not to be disrespecting for that, but all of the people would in a sense come within your orbit, that there was some gene within you, and you're now saying it was just my mother. >> it's not just one thing, charlie. it's a mixture of things. but my mother made me feel if i tried something and didn't succeed, it didn't matter. she never worried about failure, and that's such an important gift to give children. when you review my life, and i write a lot about that in the book, the best thing that happened to me is i did not make happen. that's important for us to remember, how much we work and make things happen -- i mean, i became a writer by accident.
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once i started writing, i knew that's what i wanted to do. but also not being defined by a particular thing, or not being willing to take risks. i mean, the way you did when you gave up the fox job because you didn't want to interview starlets in hollywood. >> charlie: yes. you gave up a big salary, and that's what i'm saying. when we take these risks, then we end up doing what we really want to do and to define ourselves rather than be defined by what our culture and society considers success. >> charlie: right. and listening to a eulogy makes you realize how eulogies are. you never have anybody be eulogized because they increased market share. >> charlie: nobody on their death beds say they wish they spent more time at the office.
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>> all the things that make life worth leaving, and i think we try to squeeze in between whatever we think success is. >> charlie: i make this point in my own head that, you know, that i have a privileged life. i have a job that i love, love, love -- or many jobs that i love, love, love -- but i have access to all kinds of things -- people, like you, my friend, great museums, a lot of things. there are people who have every bit and more goodness in their heart and soul, who are single mothers, trying to get a kid through school in a tough neighborhood, who have no time to enjoy all the things that we're saying they ought to enjoy, you know, and that they are, in a sense, want to do for their daughter what your mom wants to do for your daughter, that they, the daughter, will have a better life than they did. >> right. >> charlie: and they have little time. so i never want to be in a position of saying, you know, you need to do all these things for the betterment of your own
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beautiful life and not lose sight of people, really a lot of people who don't have that luxury. >> but that's why everything i say is for everyone, including i have an entire section on extreme circumstances, like people in concentration camps. it doesn't get more extreme than that. and yet what victor franco wrote was that the one ultimate freedom that nobody can take away from us is the freedom to choose our own attitude. and no matter what is happening in our lives, whether we're struggling to put food on the table or the top of the world, we can choose an attitude, and we can choose really how we react to what is happening to us, which is the whole stoic philosophy. every night, a writer would go to bed and write his meditations to put everything that happened in the world in perspective and also at the other extreme, when
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illinois bell downsized half the company and followed people who were downsized to see what happened to them, two-thirds of them fell apart. they became alcoholics, they became depressed, they got divorced. one-third of them thrived. what was the difference? >> charlie: what was the difference? >> the difference is that resilience. you know, how do we cultivate our own inner resources? >> charlie: but that's you. this is one-third of people who are -- >> charlie: i mean, think about your own evolution of your life. have you gone from one arena to another arena to another arena? think about a deciding you wanted to be governor of california. >> and i was and i failed. you may not have noticed that -- >> charlie: i did notice that. but what was interesting about my appreciation of you is you were willing to try and fail,
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because you might have succeeded in different circumstances. >> because i learned. >> charlie: you learned from your failure. >> i learned a lot. >> charlie: and there was something inside of you that said it won embarrass me if i don't seeks, and you come out of that and start to write a blog that becomes one of the most important online vehicles out there. where do you get that? is that from your mother? is that something you developed? >> well, i really think -- >> charlie: is it in your genes or -- >> i think we all have it. >> charlie: we don't unleash it. >> yes, we all have this place of wisdom, strength, peace in us, and christianity, the bible calls it the kingdom of god. my compatriot calls it give me a place to stand and i can move the world. we all have it. the question is do we give
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ourselves time? i'm talking about taking some of our life to connect with it and that means disconnecting from our technology. >> charlie: you do that for a week? >> yes, we do a digital detox for a week. >> charlie: how did that go? it was fantastic. i was actually on vacation with my daughters and my ex-husband. >> charlie: michael. i recommend co-parenting. >.i did not take pictures for social media, i did not do email. i was just fully present, and that's something -- >> charlie: so what did you do when you were fully present? >> whatever i was doing, i was there. i was not multi-tasking. multi-tasking is one of the great illusions of our times. >> charlie: let me talk about
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things if your life. "huffington post" -- >> we're in eleven countries. >> charlie: paris, britain. spain, italy, germany, u.k., canada, japan, south korea, india, greece. >> charlie: what do you want, when you dream deeply, what is it you want the "huffington post" to be? >> well, what we are doing right now, which is actually leading this conversation around the issues of how do people lead their lives -- >> charlie: this is what you want "huffington post" to be? >> i'm always looking for new things. in terms of politics and news, established just a great place for the "huffington post," not just here but internationally, in terms of our media, doing well, internationally keep going, but i'm always looking at what is next. at the moment, i see the global
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shift happening where more and more people are entering this conversation, and 2013 was the year when we had c.e.o. of c.e.o. come out as not being gay but as a med tater. >> charlie: oh, sure. yes (naming c.e.o.s) >> and something is happening where this conversation five years ago may have been seen as more agey, flakey, california, is now seen as main stream >> charlie: what does meditation do for you? bobob roth talked to me about i. we had a conversation about that this weekend >> so what it does, it just helps you connect with that place that you mentioned, with our center. most of us are not there, we veer away. you connect and reconnect with it. so whatever challenges,
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obstacles, there is the place you know and you become more and more acquainted with and it's is place that poets and philosophers have all written about. >> charlie: that's where i want to be, what they write about. so what about politics and you? can you ever imagine getting back in the political arena? >> no. >> charlie: no? no, absolutely not. >> charlie: what arena that you're not in might you be in? or do you think your last great act is creating the "huffington post"? >> well, i think that what i'm doing right now is infinitely expandable. you know, there are so many things that i can do. in my current job, i didn't think i would write the 14t 14th book. this is a surprise baby. i felt anything i wanted to do right, i could do at the "huffington post," but after i gave the commencement speech -- >> charlie: there was a response to that? >> there was this response and
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people asked me to write a book and, finally, i i felt there was a great value in putting it all together, and between the pages of scientific footnotes. >> charlie: being the life force that you are, what is it that you don't like about yourself? >> well, i wish i had learned these lessons younger. >> charlie: these lessons? yes. i was very stubborn. i had to be in a pool of blood to realize i was not leading my life in a way that's sustainable. >> charlie: yeah, but you were sort of new agey, and had done a lot of mystical things and -- i mean, you had experimented with these things. you'd had an opportunity to be aware of this before you were -- >> before i injured myself. that's so true. i definitely had exposed myself to many of the teachings and many of the philosophers who
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addressed these issues, but it's different to be aware of something and to actually introduce them in your own life in a consistent way. >> charlie: the book is called "thrive: the third metric to redefining success and creating a life of well-being, wisdom, and wonder." that's for me. thank you. >> thank you. >> charlie: great to see you. thank you, charlie. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh 
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